"So please explain to me what it is that you all want? So you realized that there is no God and the reasonings you were told are lies..so now what? You are in lost. You don't believe but yet you need to follow and comply because there is no way out. I just want to understand what it is that you want!?....Do you really want to live your life a sham? Lying to everyone while secretly doing what you please? Does that turn you on? I just do not get it. What is the difference if you just dont do any work on Shabbos if you are not going public. PLEASE explain to me what is the lifestyle you want!!!"
What do we want? Ultimately what we want is for Judaism to be true. Or maybe I should speak for myself when I say that. The problem is that it is not or at least as far as anyone can prove or even argue successfully.
But we also don't want to be goyim (again, speaking for myself). Not that goyim are in any way inferior, but that we are Jews and that is our heritage and that doesn't change if the metaphysics or theology is faulty. Some people stay because of family ties or because they like the community. Also reasons which I share.
So we are obviously conflicted. Which life do we want? I'm not sure.That's a judgement call that each person in our situation must make for himself. But you fail to understand the basics here because you think our desire for a preferential "lifestyle" is what drives us to doubt. But more often it is doubt that drives people to adopt a different lifestyle.
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4 comments:
Sorry all these posts are coming in now. I'm a bit into the blogging world at the moment (at the expense of all my college work . . .), so going back in time to interesting posts.
First off, if you haven't gotten it before, I'm largely in the same boat as you. That said, I can enumerate my reasons for staying within Orthodoxy. Most important is the fact that I am strongly Jewish. I guess you could equate it to reform in that I connect very strongly with the cultural and historical aspect of our people. We've lasted this long, and in a nationalistic fashion, I'm all in favor of keeping us around for another couple thousand years or so . . .
That said, I think that there's a way in which this must be done and Halacha gives us this framework. Its a system where we recognize that cultural-ness will not last long if we don't have the actions to back them up. Otherwise, we end up all assimilating and poof- gone are the Jews. That said, Halacha is fuzzy. Do I agree with all of it? Not really. A lot of it makes sense (after all, contemporary Halacha, in terms of medicine and all is largely just regular ethics called Halacha to make it more Jewish sounding), but a lot of it doesn't. Even so, it has been acceped, and once we buy into the system of action and Halacha binding us as people, it only makes sense to ascribe to all of it. Otherwise, we break up the unity even further, and are no better off than before.
And so, I completely understand those that disregard Halacha, and don't beat myself up when I fail at something. But I try. And I try hard. And I learn. A lot. B/c I truly feel that the only way to survive as a nation is to unify under the system that we have which best allows for our survival - and that is the system of Halacha.
It's nice to see that there are a few other people besides for me who come out of Brooklyn without having been taken over by its illogical insanity.
Sarah,
"Sorry all these posts are coming in now."
No worries. It's not as if I get so many responses on my blog that I can't respond to each one within a day or so.
"(at the expense of all my college work . . .)"
LOL! Tell me about it... ;-)
"That said, I think that there's a way in which this must be done and Halacha gives us this framework."
Anyone can see that Jews absent of the laws and customs soon lose their Jewishness and assimilate into their surrounding societies. And as I have a love for Jewishness (whatever that may be exactly) I can't leave the laws and watch my kids grow up without a solid sense of being Jews.
"B/c I truly feel that the only way to survive as a nation is to unify under the system that we have which best allows for our survival - and that is the system of Halacha."
I don't see that the current halacha makes as much sense as it could. It has been evolving for millennia and I would like to see it change again. But I don't want to be the one who leaves the community. I want the community to change with me still in it.
Maybe it won't happen in my life. Maybe it won't happen in my children's life. But I do think it will happen eventually. It's inevitable. When it does come, I'd like to see my children still being counted among them.
Unifying under the "system" may work for some time, but the system is not impervious to change. And in some cases it is wholly incompetent for use in the modern world. It does need some updating. But slowly is best. I'd like to work within the system then go outside of it.
"It's nice to see that there are a few other people besides for me who come out of Brooklyn without having been taken over by its illogical insanity."
There are a few of us. More than you might think actually. Check out the frum skeptics group, the link is on the front page.
"I don't see that the current halacha makes as much sense as it could. It has been evolving for millennia and I would like to see it change again"
Well, maybe this is just wishful thinking, but I feel like Halacha (in the higher, objective sense - although I'm not sure there really is an objective version...) is pretty flexible and open to interpretation. The problem is that somewhere along the line it became the fashion, so to say, to make it as stringent as they possibly could for no logical reason, besides for the ever-useful "daas torah".
Also, I think it has changed to a great degree. Take a look at Frumteens.com and its clear that the MO community has come along way. Yes, they still play into UO thinking a lot, and many for some reason, feel guilty enough about their MO beliefs to give in to a lot of the illogical UO ideology, but we have come a long way. Women learn Gemara, guys are girls are (shocker!) allowed to talk. I agree that a lot more must be done, but I do think that the means are there to bring a change about.
Sarah,
"The problem is that somewhere along the line it became the fashion, so to say, to make it as stringent as they possibly could for no logical reason, besides for the ever-useful "daas torah"."
Fundamentalism in action.
"I agree that a lot more must be done, but I do think that the means are there to bring a change about."
There are always means. Societies and organizations are not monolithic mountains. They are made up of people. Individuals. You can change people's minds slowly, locally. One person at a time.
But people like continuity and most dislike new ideas. That's why rapid changes in society are so uncommon and so difficult to maintain. But as each generation becomes free of the last, change happens.
You and I are no less Jews because we disagree with the majority on how Orthodoxy is set up. And I can assure you, you and I are hardly the only disillusioned people in the Jewish world. It may be people like us who change it all.
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